Great egret

33 posts / 0 new
Last post
Birdgirl2009
Birdgirl2009's picture
Great egret

Here is a beautiful breeding adult great egret, with black bill, green face and white plumes



Araminta
Araminta's picture

Ooooo,what beautiful shots,I could look at them for ever and ever. Birds are just exquisit creatures!!

M-L

birdie
birdie's picture

Birdgirl, I am going to disagree slightly with a comment that Windhover said in another post..... I defy any SLR to take a crisper shot in that situation!!

Beautiful bird, beautiful lighting, and beautifully taken!

Well done, and whatever you buy don't get rid of that as a backup camera ... it is brilliant.

I think the creativity that seeing 'live' through the lens allows will be the big difference for you.

Because it allows to to create a different feel with depth of field and a kind of 3D roundness to a shot that is beyond what you can do with your kind of camera.

I totally agree with Windhover that I would rather have less of a body and more of a lens any day . I would still recommend the basic 1000D canon kit as it will give you two lenses to use for around $800 . That is what I am using . then put any extra dollars towards one of the better lenses. The way the twin lens kits are marketed, you will save next to nothing by buying a Body only, unless you get a 2nd hand one. There are pros and cons with that too. I believe it is important to know the history of a camera body.... has it been exposed to sand, moisture or impact damage? you may never know the answers to these by even just a quick look... and any one of them can be devastating to the equipment.

Just my opinion, albeit that I used to be a wholesale camera rep and had a vested interest in maintaining this point of view. LOL But it also means I have seen first hand
the end results at the camera service counter.

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Windhover
Windhover's picture

What situation Birdie?

birdie
birdie's picture

I meant just the way the Egret is situated in that tree that's all. What I mean is that even an SLR couldn't get a better looking shot in my opinion :)

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Windhover
Windhover's picture

IN this case perhaps not, but most likely in the right hands yes. At least better control of overall exposure where detail in white feathers would be maintained. One thing to remember is that a DSLR will have a far more advanced sensor than a P&S camera. In other words, it will render a lot more detail and so on! That's generally speaking. In any case, the egret looks fab in breeding plumage and colors! :)

birdie
birdie's picture

You are such a perfectionist Akos :'p

That is why your pics are so great I guess!

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Birdgirl2009
Birdgirl2009's picture

Thank you very much for your kind words, Araminta and birdie.
Windhover, as you guessed I am just an amateur who enjoys taking photos of birds. This is only my 3rd camera; my first was a little Kodak 126 with a magicube flash!, which I had for 11 years and my 2nd was a Pentax k1000, which I had for 24 years. I won't be going back to an slr because I love the freedom of taking as many photos as I want and being able to check as I go. I think there is much more to learn on this camera: I know there are settings for light and dark subjects but I didn't use them. Often with birds you are lucky to get any shot at all - these flew away as I walked under their trees. I like to get something different (at least for me) such as a species I haven't seen, breeding shots or quirky behaviour.
I do have a perfectionist streak and just love a good sharp photo. Maybe we need to have different parts of the forum for professional photos, photos people take in their own backyards and interesting photos they take elsewhere.

Windhover
Windhover's picture

I don't and didn't mean to come across as a perfectionist or condescending. No way, that's not me. And certainly I would never think of me as professional. A professional earns their income from photography. Anyone who claims to be a professional BIRD photographer in Australia is most likely full of themselves. There are very few if any. The only one I can think of is Steve Parish, but he does all subjects not just birds. :)
The truth about DLSR vs P&S is (in my humble opinion) as I stated in the above pane. You are doing an excellent job Birdgirl with the gear you have so you ought to be very, very proud of that. But there will come a day when you will long for better equipment especially if this infectious passion of bird photography grabs you! Though I think you are already there. :) Regarding the forum, I don't know why it would cost 30K to rebuild (from what I think Birdie told me). They can download phpBB for free and use it (I believe). I have that database installed on my server and run it like that. Easy to administer, easy to use and a better platform than this one. I must tell Holly about it.

birdie
birdie's picture

Sorry, I don't think it is necessary for this forum to have a professional forum that will get full of blow hards trying to get off on their own ego trips!
We are all ( including Windhover) amateurs or serious amateurs Birdgirl , though some may be more zealous than others, so don't worry about that. Personally I think pictures taken in a backyard are as interesting as those taken when out on trips and can't see the need for separation of the two. Equipment discussion would be a useful sub-heading within the photography area. Helpful hints and tips could be another one. As for the professionals...there are plenty of other forums for those who want to show off and critique for the sake of critiquing! I feel the primary aim of this forum is and should be to promote the awareness and knowledge of the birds in and around our habitat and the ecosystems that they require to sustain their populations. Any photo that is generated by the excitement that this pursuit brings should always be welcome regardless.

Your pics are brilliant Birdgirl and it is obvious to me also that you will inevitably be looking for better equipment as your passion grows. By "going back to an SLR" I gather you mean back to film SLRs? A digital SLR is what we meant in case you hadn't realised.

BTW I think your Lumix is a few steps ahead of the average point and shoot camera adn yes, there is probably a bit more stuff for you to play with still. :')

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Araminta
Araminta's picture

Wow birdie, quite a speech, somewhat clears the air. I enjoy all your photos, I get to see birds from up North and West, that don't exist down here in Victoria. I'm not sure, where I fit into all of that, because I don't even have a camera? (I wish I had a Lumix, and could take photos as brilliant as you do Birdgirl!) But, I love watching the birds in my backyard, and can identify most of them. I do the best I can for the environment and the wildlife around me, and will continue to do so. Listening to birds, and seeing them is a great pleasure for me, I love it!! Even if I will never take a photo in my life!!

M-L

birdie
birdie's picture

oh... I hope I didn't go OTT with the "speech" Araminta.... you know it is very therapeutic to write down what you are feeling? LOL Didn't mean to take to the soap box ;')

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Wanda
Wanda's picture

What a stunner, Birdgirl!

Windhover
Windhover's picture

Well said Birdie. :)

Birdgirl2009
Birdgirl2009's picture

I'm happy to keep using the forum just as it is, because I mostly just want to look at photos, but I wouldn't have a problem with a section for professional photographers because I would enjoy looking at their photos and I would learn a lot if they put their camera, lens and settings with their photo.
I would also find it useful to have a section on tips - I'd read that - and also one on equipment, although at the rate I buy camera equipment I wouldn't need it very often!
Birdie and Windhover (and anyone else) - what do you think of the new Canon 7D? Do all Canon EOS lenses fit all Canon EOS cameras if you just buy the body first? What lens or lens + teleconversion lens would you recommend to get to at least 600mm and does using a teleconversion lens reduce the quality of the image very much? Thanks in advance!

birdie
birdie's picture

By all account the 7D is a brilliant camera. If you are going to buy that top end kind of body then Body only is fine but you would need something to use on it? Unless you already have some EOS lenses? I believe the newer EF lenses are made with different refractive properties for use with the digital SLRs in order to give better performance, but yes they should fit most of the EF series with a few exceptions that I doubt you would be using.
If you are going to buy a TC , then I would echo Windhover's sentiments that you buy the very best you can afford. In other words stick to a Canon if possible because the better quality piece of glass you stick at the rear of your lens to increase its power, then the better quality result you will get. Akos uses one and gets great results. If you can get the 100 - 400L with a 1.4X then that should do you or the 2X if you want to increase the magnification. Remember that 2X takes two f.stops of light from your lens and I think the 1.4X is 1.5 stops. This means you would need extra light or faster ISO or flash if there is not enough light available.
Hope this helps Birdgirl and as for the Pro section of the forum..... I can suggest some sights if you want to look at pictures ..... I really hope we don't get inflicted with it on this friendly forum :') ( just my humble opinion)
Cheers

Birdie

Sunshine Coast Queensland

birdie
birdie's picture

If you are going to use a teleconverter.... then you need a decent widest aperture on whatever lens you use. In other words I wouldn't bother putting one of a lens with a maximum of F5.6 unless you were shooting in bright sunny conditions that is.

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Birdgirl2009
Birdgirl2009's picture

Thanks a lot birdie. I'm not familiar with the Canon range but lots of the great wildlife photographers seem to use Canon or Nikon. I wasn't sure if EF went with EOS or was a different line. I would definitely need a lens but some of the prices seem to be better when body and lens are bought separately and you really need to shop around - there can be a many-fold difference in price for the same gear.
BTW we are going to NZ in the hols so I hope to see lots of NZ birds. I won't be taking my camera but my husband has just bought a very small light Lumix which seems to be very good.

Windhover
Windhover's picture

The 7D is great camera. I don't know if newer Canon lenses are particularly made for DSLR cameras in all honesty, but knowing Canon no longer make film cameras it would make sense. Sigma, a third party lens manufacturer has (I think) DX or something like that to designate specifically made lenses to use with DSLRs. In any case, EF lenses from Canon are autofocus ones and will only work on autofocus cameras. Canon's older lenses (FD I think) will not autofocus and will need adapters so don't bother with them. Too much fluffing around.

Lens wise, to get anywhere near 600mm, you'd need something like a 300mm f/2.8L IS USM lens (+ 2x converter). The lens is around $5,000 or so and the newer version about to be released will be around $7,000 because it's going to be lighter and redesigned so they will sting your pocket. The current 300/2.8 is a kick-ass lens though! I have used it and you get all AF points autofocus with a 2x at 600mm f/8. As for the loss of light with teleconverters, with a 2x converter you lose 2 stops and you lose one stop with a 1.4x converter.

All cameras EXCEPT the 1D or 1Ds series (MkI, MkII, MkIII and MkIV) will only autofocus up to a maximum aperture of f/5.6. That is a 7D with a 300mm f/4 lens and 1.4x converter becomes a 420mm f/5.6 lens so it will autofocus. If you then put a 2x on a 300mm f/4 lens then you have a 600mm f/8 lens so only manual focus is possible. A 1D or 1Ds will autofocus at f/8 but only with the center AF point. Better than nothing I guess. :) The difference between the 1D and 1Ds series is that a 1Ds is a FULL FRAME sensor (36mm x 24mm). A 1D is what they call an APS-H sensor that gives a 1.3x mutliplication factor for the lenses used. So a 100mm lens will have a field of view equivalent to 130mm. On a 7D, the 100mm lens would have a field of view equivalent to 160mm because the sensor is even smaller, APS-C size, giving a 1.6x focal length multiplier effect.

I would recommend a used 1D MkII or MkIIn body and a 400mm f/5.6L USM (no Image Stabilization) lens and a 1.4x converter. That will give you a 560mm f/8 lens that is pretty dang good. No IS means you would need a good tripod. Not the flimsy crap for $99.00 though, but a decent one, with a decent ball head or a mongoose head. It really depends on how much money you want to spend, but I would say around $5,000 will get you a used 1D MkII or MkIIn body, a new 400/5.6L, 1.4x converter, tripod and head. You would also want a flash, around $600 and a better beamer flash extender (around $50 with postage from the USA). Too many options aye? But it's worthy to note that even 600mm focal length is not enough for small birds. You have to be very close and it takes time to get used to finding the bird in the viewfinder because of the very narrow angle of view given at long focal lengths. Confusing yet? :)

Birdgirl2009
Birdgirl2009's picture

Oh yes, confusing all right! But I really appreciate you taking the time to give me so much detail. I don't get that just by looking at pages of models and specifications. I'm going to have to read your post quite a few times to take it in. But I'm not in a rush - it is a big decision. And the prices of some of the lenses are frightening.
I never use a tripod or a flash (may explain omissions from my photos?) and I think I need image stabilisation because my hands do shake when I hold my heavy camera and long lens.
I can see I need to relearn a lot of basics - there was a time when I was quite competent with my slr (and I did have a sigma lens for it!) and understood quite a bit about what I what I was doing. Now I need to update

birdie
birdie's picture

Ahem..... yes I would think so :')

Birdgirl, am I getting the wrong picture or are you very much an amateur and not necessarily in need of a Pro camera? I have spent a lot of years selling cameras and it sounds to me as if you need to first ascertain your budget ( for everything you will need to start with anyway) and then your aspirations for the next couple of years with your bird photography. We all think differently about such things and it is very much horses for courses if you know what I mean.
Windhover has some good advice but it may be a little too top end for you, I don't know. ( Meant with no offence to him at all)

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Birdgirl2009
Birdgirl2009's picture

hi birdie
If money was no problem I would not hesitate to get the best pro gear on the market (wouldn't we all!), retire and spend my days out looking for birds to photograph.
However, with 2 kids and a house to fix, I will have to be content with something more modest. It would have to be significantly better than the camera I have now to make it worth me spending the money at all (and to me that means sharpness, clarity, being able to see texture as well as just colour), but not more than probably $3000
Bird photography is a hobby, but one I try to put time into every week and I definitely do want to get better at photography, not just have a catalogue of birds I have seen

birdie
birdie's picture

Birdgirl should you ever want to email me about anything that you think I could help you with ... birdmania57@gmail.com

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Birdgirl2009
Birdgirl2009's picture

Thanks birdie, I'll put that in my address book. I think I need to ask lots of questions before I make a decision ... or give it up because I'm too overwelmed!

birdie
birdie's picture

You are welcome, and no need to get overwhelmed..... there is a level for everyone with good equipment available . The beauty of today's cameras is that you can buy above your need and grow into it and they all do a great job. ( Especially if you buy Canon LOL)

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Birdgirl2009
Birdgirl2009's picture

ok, I'll sleep on it.

sparrow
sparrow's picture

Hi, like Birdie said no need to be overwhelmed,you've set a budget that realistic for you,a lot of the pro's i know use canon mainly for the lenses but even what they consider cheap is more than us real people can afford.
Look at what is available in the well known brands there all pretty good .
ask around go into shops and get a feel for what your looking for.
then go out and get a nikon D90 "just kidding "

birdie
birdie's picture

:') Goodnight all

Sweet dreams Birdgirl ( and you too Sparrow )

Sunshine Coast Queensland

joanneh
joanneh's picture

well having read aLL that i would be confused as well, but your egret picture is very good and i as i am sure you are would be very happy with it. Remember some have the biggest and the best but still can't take decent photos :) i have recently upgraded my birding lens to decent glass and i really noticed the difference, like they say the money is in the lens.there is always christmas and birthday money :)meanwhile your photos are good

Windhover
Windhover's picture

the only reason I mention a used 1D series (which is the pro line of Canon's) because Birdgirl asked to get to the vicinity of 600mm. More than one way to kill a cat really and all depends how much you want to spend or can afford to. In my experience though, I would now buy a used 1D body even over a 7D. Now, the funny thing is, when you use a 30D, 40D, 50D, 7D, or any camera with an APS-C sensor that "multiples" your focal length (not technically, just crops it) even my poor combo gives the equivalent of 672mm field of view. Yet, it is NOT enough for anything other than say Swamphen size or bigger. Hence why you would consider the 1D (1.3x FOV crop) a 400/5.6L and 1.4x. Because while the true focal length of that combo is 560mm, multiply by 1.3 due to the 1D series APS-H sensor giving the 1.3x multiplying factor and you get 560x1.3 or 728mm field of view equivalent still a bit more magnification. Bird photography is all about as much magnification as you can afford to buy. The easier things become. :)
Although depending on what you want with the images as an end user and you can do what a lot, lot, lot of people do and buy a 7D that has 18 megapixels and crop the hell out of your images. But that still won't give you the best image quality and will not improve your photography skills. Anybody can crop. A mate of mine has a 7D and 300/4L IS like mine and a 1.4x. He gets pretty good shots. Still, that would be very much stretching over your budget. :(

Birdgirl2009
Birdgirl2009's picture

I'm happy to get any input, even if some of it is above my head, so thanks to all. I've picked up some valuable information in this disussion and I'm sure I'll have more quesions
This was something I would not thought of myself:
'All cameras EXCEPT the 1D or 1Ds series (MkI, MkII, MkIII and MkIV) will only autofocus up to a maximum aperture of f/5.6.'
I have only been using autofocus, even for tracking flying birds, so that was something I really needed to know

aa
aa's picture

i like the details and colors on the 1st one birdgirl :)

sparrow
sparrow's picture

I think you have been confused by all the tech mumbo jumbo i would take up birdies offer and chat away from the forum
canon nikon it doesn't matter they all work the same way and they both have modals well inside your budget.
spend your money on the best glass you can afford thats what makes the real difference

 and   @birdsinbackyards
                 Subscribe to me on YouTube