Chestnut-breasted mannikin

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Birdgirl2009
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Chestnut-breasted mannikin

I went out this morning to look for BOP and did not see a single one. Instead I saw small birds in the weeds and reeds

Windhover
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That's a great shot of a male. Out of curiosity, what suburb was this? I have a couple of reliable locations in the Penrith area for this species. :)

Birdgirl2009
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At East Maitland in NSW.
I wanted to ask you something:
If you bought a Canon EOS 7D, body only, which lens would you buy to get the best sharpest photos at high magnification without paying $9000? Something versatile (not starting at f5.6 and only able to be used in bright sunny conditions)

Windhover
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may I ask what amount are you prepared to spend on the lens? You may be better off getting a "worse" body and better lens that's all. $$$$ will help me try and help you. :)

Birdgirl2009
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Probably about $3000 total. I may need to get a teleconversion lens/extender. I don't want to lose magnification if I get a new camera. I have my teleconversion lens on almost all the time (420 + 1.7x). It's great for little birds, birds in trees and flying birds

Windhover
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420mm and a 1.7x, is that not Nikon or is it a typo? Also, are you combining TCs? 420mm is usually a 300/1.4x combo.

You'd be far better of with a Canon 100-400L IS USM lens and a 1.4x converter used on an old 1D MkII body, which will autofocus with the center point when a lens with a maximum aperture of f/8 is used. The 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L lens and 1.4x converter becomes a 140-560mm f/6.3-8 lens. Camera is not the be all end all. The lens should cost around $2,200 and you could pick up a used 1D MkII off E-bay for under $1,000. There are a lot of variables and with lenses you do get what you pay for. But they are far more important than the camera body!!!

Windhover
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Add around $250-300 for a Canon EF 1.4x MkII converter!

Birdgirl2009
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No it is a Panasonic Lumix fz 50. The non-removable zoom on it is 35-420 m and I bought a 1.7x teleconversion lens - same brand.
Still reading ...

Birdgirl2009
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That is the lens I had my eye on.

Wht do you think of the extenders

EF 2x III

EF 2x II

EF 1.4x III

EF 1.4x II

The Canon web site does not clearly say what the differences are (apart from 2x and 1.4x being obvious). It also does not say which lenses are compatible with which cameras and which extenders are compatible with which lenses

Windhover
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The MkII and MkIII difference is that the MkIII are newer converters specifically designed to work with the new super telephotos such as 300/2.8L MkII, 400/2.8L MkII, 500/4L MkII and 600/4L MkII lenses. The MkII converters are perfectly OK to use. All are compatible with all cameras, but you need to be aware that only the 1D series cameras like the 1D, 1D MkII, 1D MkIIn, 1D MkII or 1D MkIV or 1Ds, 1Ds MkII or 1Ds MkII will let you use autofocus with a lens, or lens and converter that has a maximum aperture of f/8. Add a 1.4x converter to your wanted 100-400L zoom and the maximum aperture at the long end of the zoom (400mm or now 560mm with the 1.4x converter added) will be f/8!!!! Do you follow the principle?

Birdgirl2009
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It's about 20 years since I did my last photography course so I'm definitely rusty.
So the III series are for all the very expensive lenses (the ones with big apertures)?
Do you mean that if I get this lens with the 7D I will have to manually focus? I don't think my eyes are up to it any more.
I think I follow you - if I have the extender on, my maximum aperture will be f8 so I'll have to have good light or use a higher iso and I won't be able to take photos with a shallow depth of field
Would I lose another stop with the 2x compared to the 1.4x?

Windhover
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With a 1.4x you lose one stop of light. With a 2x it's two stops. On any Canon body other than a 1D or 1Ds series body, your lens (prime or zoom) must have at least an aperture of f/4 (maximum) for a 1.4x converter to enable autofocus or f/2.8 with the 2x. A 7D will NOT autofocus with a 100-400L zoom that is attached to the 1.4x converter. Not at all!

Windhover
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Sorry, the MkIII converters are made for the refined MkII telephotos as I mentioned. Optically they are a better match. The MkII converters are still fine for the new teles, but not optimal for the MkIII have better glass. Canon EF converters can only be matched to Canon telephoto lenses. Eg, 70-200f/4L, 300/4L, 400/4DO, etc... They cannot be used with non-L lenses at all! :)

Windhover
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Another point, if you add a teleconverter to an f/5.6 lens. Eg you have a 100-400 to become the 140-560mm lens with the converter, f/8 will NOT give you the same depth of field as if you selected f/8 on a 50mm lens. Depth of field is a lot, lot, lot shallower with a telephoto/super telephoto lens than an ordinary lens.

Owen1
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my dad has a 10-500 sigma dg lens with a pentax k10d and the lens workd beautifully-ive taken a liking to sigma lenses, it will work well in any conditions and has a good range of f.stop and iso values

Cheers, Owen.

ed
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Hi Birdgirl watch the weight, I use a 100-400L on a 40D, (thinking of upgrading to a 7D)and it gets very heavy after a while in the field and takes a fair bit of strength to handle. See if you can hire or borrow one to try, the push pull zoom takes a bit of getting used too. I went from a FZ to the kit I'm using now and it is a big leap.Maybe stay with a shorter (lighter) lens with a EF1.4 (and remember the sensors in the 40D and 7D will give you a further 1.6 factor) may suit better.Having said that the 40D/100-400L can produce a great picture.

Ed Townsville NQ

birdie
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Ha ha ..... I am deeply hurt that you didn't trust my judgement Kim!!!! (just joking) LMAO Didn't I say that would be the one to go for???? Did you look where I said to look for examples of work and the gear they were taken with?

I only wish I had the money to go for one ! I agree with Akos... if it is a choice between lens and body, then the lens wins every time as that is where the image is made :')

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Birdgirl2009
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Thank you all very much for your help. You've probably saved me a great deal of time and money. I'm weighing this up carefully, not rushing into anything. As you know I was asking questions a few months ago and I still haven't bought anything.
I guess what I'm looking for is something similar to what I have now but which produces a sharper picture. My current camera auto focuses with the teleconversion lens on and my magnification is 712 mm.
Maybe it's me that needs the work though (I have ordered more books from Amazon) LOL
windhover - what you told me was so important. I need that auto focus and I would not like to be only able to shoot in bright light. DOF probably doesn't worry me that much as long as my subject is in sharp focus
owen - I used to have a sigma zoom for my Pentax k1000
ed - the weight is a serious consideration. I've seen it on the Canon web site. My current camera gets heavy after a while. Trialling it is a very good idea, if someone would trust me! btw I loved your photos on the other web site
birdie - of course I trusted you! How could you think I wouldn't? LOL Actually I was really pleased with what you said because that was the lens I had my eye on. Sorry I hadn't got round to replying though. I looked at the web site and loved the photos - I looked at them and forgot to think about the gear. It's one I'll spend more time looking at in future. Thanks for that - I hadn't come across it by myself

Birdgirl2009
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windhover, the 7D will autofocus if it just has the 100-400 lens on it but no extender, won't it?

birdie
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Forgot to say Nice little bird !!!
I think the answer to your last question would be yes but haven't looked it up.

Sunshine Coast Queensland

Windhover
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You're correct Birdgirl. Since the 100-400mm lens is f/5.6 when zoomed into 400mm, the 7D or any other body WILL AF. :)

Birdgirl2009
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Thanks for that - I'm still looking and dreaming. It's good to have a few facts now

sparrow
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Hi birdgirl,the weight and size difference between what your using now and a 7d is huge and a 100-400 is fair lump of glass,I don't know where you live but in Melbourne we have a few places where you can hire gear for the day,I'm not trying to put you off it's a great combo but it is heavy compared to your fz50 ,I use a sigma 300f4 with a 1.4 converter because i'm getting to old and lazy to lug big zooms around,i got lucky the old sigma is one of the sharpest lenses i have used and is a lot lighter,and i picked it up on ebay for $250 but like i said i got lucky !

cathshane

Nice shot Birdgirl.

birdie
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Hey Sparrow great to see you again... so you just have the fixed lens for birding requirements then? Or do you have other zooms for versatility? I can't remember sorry.....old age creeping in. the reason I ask is that sounds like a good scheme for me to investigate , given that I will never get the money for anything in the L range with canon. I find I need a shorter length though when I am in the local forest as the little birds suddenly appear out of nowhere.....usually right by my elbow or just over my head LOL

Birdgirl it is a great suggestion to fine somewhere you can try one..... I have a friend in the photo industry in Sydney I'll ask her if she knows of anywhere up your way.

Sunshine Coast Queensland

sparrow
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Hi birdie.I have a few zooms nikon,80-200f2.8, 80-200f4, 70-300,75-300 80-400vr and have access to a sigma 150-500os which i really like,but i seem to be using the 300mm sigma more often i also have a couple of tamrons which will go back on ebay as soon i can be bothered listing them and will never buy another.
I originally bought the sigma as a fill in until i got another nikon 300mm after mine failed the drop test,but it turned out to better than i thought,it's much lighter,pin sharp,and focuses faster,it's been well used and makes some strange noises,and i do cop a bit of flack over it, when it finally does die i will not hesitate to get another,a friend who uses canons to shoot motorbike racing has switched to sigma because he likes the colour rendition and he can afford to buy anything he wants,not that im jealous mind you!

abeleski
abeleski's picture

Like sparrow my favourite field walkabout setup is a Nikon 300 F4. Not exactly light but much lighter than a longer lens or a 300 F2.8. Works nicely with a 1.4x TC too for that extra little bit of range. I also use it with a 1.7xTC for shooting stationary objects when AF speed is not a concern.

I was born to live and I live to die.

Birdgirl2009
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Thanks all for your comments - I have learnt something from each of you. I haven't taken the plunge yet but I can see from my last lot of photos I have to get my lens cleaned soon

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